3 Responses to “Call for More Women in Emergency Medicine Sparks Online Debate Among ACEP Now Readers”

1. 

   July 25, 2016

   AM Reply

   What is wrong with you??? All of the comments are the reason medicine is the most archaic profession with regards to gender equality. We are supposedly taught compassion and empathy, but I see none of that in any of these comments.

   Sure, it sucks to cover maternity leave, but that’s why we have partners–to cover for us if there are issues (i.e. cancer/illness/pregnancy/deaths). Show some empathy! Stop treating your partners (male and female) like they don’t matter–this attitude is why there is a physician shortage!

2. 

   July 26, 2016

   BokieDockie Reply

   If I remember basic biology well, men and women are not created equal and, let us face it, bringing about quality in the workplace will have to include helping women overcome barriers to engaging in professional life. In addition, and this is a very logical argument (I’d know, I am a female with two PhDs and one MD, so I am super darn logical- it HAS been proven; also- miraculously not on my period today- what do ya know?; Is this enough for the misogyny-sympathizers on this board to accept an argument from a FELLOW EM doctor?; unbelievable, just unbelievable) all females do not get pregnant at the same time. So don’t make yourselves out to be such bloody martyrs because you are not the only ones bearing the burden of EM chicks taking the oh so long on average 2-week maternity leave. Oh you poor men who have to work so hard. Cry me a bloody river. Laughable.

3. 

   August 7, 2016

   Mark Buettner Reply

   Dear “Super Darn Logical” Ms. Dr. BokieDockie MD, PhD, PhD; I agree with your first assertion that men and women are not created equal. However, I have a number of questions about the remainder of your assertions.

   Let’s start with “Quality in the workplace”.

   Would you please clarify for us the meaning of this new “Quality of the workplace”?
   What will it look like in practice?
   How will we measure this “Quality”?
   Will this new “Quality in the workplace” benefit everyone in the workplace? If not, wouldn’t it be more accurate to refer to the effort as bringing about a better “Quality of workplace for Women”?
   When you state that “bringing about “Quality” will have to include helping women overcome barriers to engaging in professional life”. Would this include either a) relieving women of their responsibility for caring for their infant children? or b) relieving women (at least temporarily) of their workplace responsibilities so they can care for their infant children? If your answer is b, wouldn’t this result in women engaging less in the workplace? Wouldn’t this directly translate into less opportunity for income? On the average, wouldn’t this create an opportunity (extra shifts or overtime hours) for men to make more income than women? Isn’t this what we are witnessing in the workplace now? Would this new quality of the workplace agenda involve correcting this income disparity with a better financial maternity stipend/benefit for women to make up for this lost opportunity? If so, wouldn’t this essentially amount to paying those women who have children more money for less work than all of their male counterparts?

   Next, Logical Arguments: A recognition of logical arguments and a rejection of fallacy is absolutely crucial for a civil society to function. I believe the current state of our society is in decay because of a lack of respect for or recognition of logical arguments. We see too often the use of and acceptance of fallacy in logic and rhetoric. Unfortunately, this seems especially so coming from the media and our political leaders. We are now seeing this phenomenon rising to alarming levels from the social justice warrior groups.

   I will accept it as truth that you have an MD and two PhD’s. I will also accept it as truth that it HAS been proven that you are “super darn logical”. Please correct me if I am wrong in considering that you have made the following logical fallacies:

   1) The listing your degrees in support of your argument is a sub category of the “Red Herring” known as argumentum ab auctoritate or Appeal to authority/Appeal to accomplishment. The “Red Herrings” are fallacies.
   2) Stating that you are “miraculously not on your period” and then referring to an entire group of individuals that may not accept your argument as “misogyny-sympathizers” is known as an Ad hominem attack. The Ad hominem is a fallacy.
   3) Your statement “unbelievable, just unbelievable” is known as the “Pooh-Pooh”fallacy which dismisses an argument perceived unworthy of serious consideration. The “Pooh-Pooh” is a fallacy.
   4) Your statement that “All females do not get pregnant at the same time” is a form of the Informal fallacy known as Ignoratio elenchi which means irrelevant conclusion or missing the point. It is irrelevant that all females do not get pregnant at the same time. Sometimes many females get pregnant at the same time. At no times do all or any males get pregnant. Ignoratio elenchi is a fallacy.
   5) The remainder of your statements involve a spattering of Ad hominem attacks that collectively rises to the level of the Ad hominem subtype known as the “Abusive fallacy”. This involves using verbal abuse to discredit one’s opponent and is a distraction from the original argument. The Abusive fallacy is a fallacy.

   Thank you Ms. Dr. BokieDockie MD, PhD, PhD. I welcome consideration of any non-fallacious response you might have.

   Sincerely,

   Mark